The Future Of Natural Foods, Supplements, and Nootropics

We just got back from Natural Products Expo West 2016.

EXPO WEST, as it is known, is the largest showcase of natural foods and products in the world. (See the exhibit hall below? There were 7+ rooms like this!)

Imagine walking down the aisle of your favorite health food store…

NOW, imagine every single company behind every product on those shelves building a massive booth to showcase their goods…


The booths start in the 100’s and go all the way to the 9000’s.

With over 600 new products this year, more than 3,000 vendors and 77,000 attendees, it’s massive, exhilarating, crazy, and sensory overload.

The Future Of Natural Foods and Supplements:

In this post – and podcast – we’re going to distill EXPO WEST 2016 down to the important things for you – the consumer.

This year, we noticed a huge move from supplements in previous years to almost all food and drinks. With record highs for new products, vendors, and attendees, the demand for natural, healthy food choices is at all time high and this is GREAT NEWS!

The shift from processed foods to natural that has driven the growth of natural food “meccas” like Whole Foods, is slowly trickling down to larger grocery chains. This year’s EXPO WEST represented that as more companies try to meet consumer demands and distributors and retailers try to get a piece of the action.

A Special Optimal Performance Podcast

In this week’s OPP, we’re breaking from our routine to chat with Natural Stacks co-founder Roy Krebs so we can share with you the trends we noticed and the products, people, and brands doing big things in the natural foods, supplement and nootropics industries.

We’re also answering listener questions – so go ahead and post your questions in the comments below and we’ll answer them on a future episode of the OPP.

What you’ll hear on this episode of the OPP:

  • New segment on the podcast. We’ll answer your questions on future episodes of the show – leave your questions in the comments below or email
  • What the ever-growing demand for healthy and natural foods means for you the consumer in regards to ingredients and labeling.
  • EPIC Bars, nose-to-tail use of animals, new cooking fats, and bone broth
  • Prebiotics, probiotics, the difference between the two and why you need both
  • The end of bathing, covering yourself in bacteria, and using animal fat for deodorant and moisturizer
  • The cival war in the mushroom supplement world: Full spectrum dried shrooms vs. distilled extracts of specific compounds within those mushrooms
  • Caveman Coffee’s new Nitro Teas and chowing down at the Bulletproof Coffee Shop in Santa Monica
  • Mark Sisson, Primal Mayo, and the new Primal Collagen Protein Bar
  • Listener question #1: The best tips to cook your food to avoid carcinogens and advanced glycation end products (AGEs)
  • Listener question #2: Optimizing your GABA levels, why phenibut is not the best GABA supplement for long-term health
  • Stacking our Brain Foods for synergistic effects and using them daily for natural optimization of your neurotransmitters
  • Roy’s daily routine – scheduling work flow for optimal productivity, supplements, and exercise
  • Honey before bed and combining the Bulletproof Diet with Carb Back-Loading and the Tim Ferriss carb approach
  • Roy’s Top 3 Tips to #LiveOptimal

Links To Our Expo West 2016 Favorites

Mother In Law’s White Kimchi (My apologies, I said Mothers In The Raw on the podcast)

Farmhouse Culture

Mother Dirt “Anti-Soap Soap”

EPIC Bone Broth

EPIC’s “Nexty” Award-Winning Duck Fat & Animal Cooking Oils

Caveman Coffee Co’s Nitro Teas (Coming Soon)

Bulletproof Cafe in Santa Monica

FatCo (formerly Fat Face Skin Care) & Stank Stop Natural Deodorant

Primal Kitchen Collagen Bars

Primal Kitchen Avocado Mayo

Tiger Nuts

Seth Roberts Blog

Serotonin Brain Food

You can take the Braverman Test and learn more about your own neurotransmitter levels by clicking here.

Post your questions below and we’ll answer them on a future podcast episode.


The Future Of Natural Foods, Supplements, and Nootropics

Ryan: Hello, you are listening to the Optimal Performance Podcast sponsored by Natural Stacks. If you’re into biohacking, performance or getting more out of life, this is the show for you! For more on building optimal performance, check out our blog that has recently moved from to

Alright, happy Thursday all you optimal performers!

Roy: St. Patty’s Day.

Ryan: Yeah, happy St. Patrick’s Day! And, you guys, that is co-founder of Natural Stacks, Roy Krebs. Roy, say hello.

Roy: Hello.

Ryan: So, for you guys listening, we’re gonna try something a little bit different today: less of me interviewing a guest and more of Roy and I talking about some things that are going on in the supplement, nootropics, biohacking world as well as answering some questions and being a little bit more interactive and engaging with you guys, the audience. So make sure you shoot me an e-mail, or leave us a comment on the blog, on the YouTube video, anywhere that you consume this information. Let us know how you like this format. Like I said, we’re gonna try this, make it a little bit different. And if you like it we’ll do more of this, maybe once a month a Q&A, maybe I answer your questions once an episode, whatever that might be. So you guys let us know, your feedback’s gonna really help us shape this going forward. So, the reason that we wanted to start this this week is that last weekend the Natural Stacks team was at Natural Products Expo West. It is the largest natural foods expo in the world. There were over 3000 vendors, 77,000 people in attendance. It was a zoo, it was amazing, it was really, really cool. And if you ever get a chance to go we highly recommend it. So we wanna talk a little bit today about what we saw and kinda let you live vicariously through us and see what it was like to be there. So, Roy, what do you – what would you like to say about it?

Roy: Yeah. First, it’s just massive, it’s hectic and very stimulating, lots of things going on. What’s interesting is there’s 600 new companies represented this year. Companies that haven’t been there before. So, these are up-and-coming companies that are looking at the trends and trying to develop something new and creating their own niche in the space. So, with so many new companies, it’s great to see how they’re branding, what their ideas are for a new product. Most of them are in the food space, the natural food space but also a bunch of supplements represented as well. And it’s great to see that mix and just what’s new and what’s – what people are feeling responsive to.

Ryan: Yeah. Ben made a really good point – our other co-founder – saying that, you know, what we actually see there is the shift from processed foods to natural foods that has driven the growth of, for example, Whole Foods or Erewhon markets in LA. It is trickling down to the larger, the more chain grocery stores and that’s something that kinda early adapters like our audience has to – we – you can’t help but be pleased to see more of that becoming mainstream.

Roy: Yeah, it’s great. I think probably every single new vendor out there was – was vegan, organic, Paleo, every certification you can get – non-GMO. Of course, there was some great beef jerky and stuff out there that’s not vegan. But everything has a strong focus on sourcing [coughs] – sourcing, traceability, is all very important.

Ryan: So when you say traceability, what do you mean? Or what comes to your mind when you say that?

Roy: It seems that – that the products have a strong focus on okay, what are the ingredients? And usually there’s only a few. Where do they come from? And that’s the messaging that a lot of these companies are starting to put across, which is great! That’s what we care about. What’s in the product? And how do we know that this is legit and it’s not ultra-processed and made in a way that isn’t the most optimal for us?

Ryan: Right. And, you know, when you say that one of the companies that comes to my mind is, you know, you already mentioned jerky. So, EPIC Bar, EPIC Provisions. I mean, that’s one that we know when we eat that we’re getting grass-fed meat. We know that they control for the most part. All of the animals, you know, except for maybe the salmon that goes into their products, they’re controlling that from start to finish. And they’re actually – one of the cool things that we saw out there at the conference was that they are – they’re going on this nose to tail movement where they’re starting to use the entire animal. So not only are they putting the meat in protein bars or jerky but they’re now gonna have bone broths in jars that’ll be available for the public, they’re gonna have duck fat and other lard or tallow that are trying to get the entire animal out to the market.

Roy: It’s great. It’s great to see them thinking that way. And – and they were actually recently purchased by General Mills. Um, but they’re staying true to their roots and expanding their product line in a way that makes sense. So, it’s great to see that. And they do – they do an awesome job with telling their story and the story of their products. And again, sourcing. Where did this stuff come from? Is it sustainable? Things like that. What I thought was interesting is that I really didn’t see many products or dietary supplements focused on brain health or performance.

Ryan: That did seem to be a – a lacking area. I mean, I don’t think – I don’t think most people would walk in there saying – and realize, the way we would, that it was a void. But that certainly stood out to all of us, that that really wasn’t an area being targeted.

Roy: Right, and there’s – there’s always the basic stuff for energy or for relaxation. And those little energy shots or something that’s supposed to make you feel some vitality or also rest and sleep and relax. But there’s nothing that takes it a step further that’s: how do I actually improve cognition or function or focus? Mental performance. So, it’s cool to see that we’re in that space and we’re doing that. And I think it’s gonna to continue to be that trend. And we’ll see next year when we show up to see if there’s – there’s more people focusing on that.

Ryan: Yeah. And we’ll be one of them, right?

Roy: Exactly, yeah.

Ryan: So, come see us at Expo West next year.

Roy: Exactly.

Ryan: So, what else stood out to you? Any other brands or companies that we came across that were innovating?

Roy: Well there were a lot. And I think just major trends. Of course, there’s – there’s so many different types of beef jerky out there now. It’s – it was almost becoming a joke. So we, you know, tried a bunch and see what it is but it’s so much competition in that space, they’re really almost all the same. So, that was, kind of, it seemed like a flooded market there. Things like – like trail mixes and Paleo bars and – those kind of seem overplayed. And certain drinks, variations on water. There’s a lot of stuff like that out there. So there were a few things that really stood out. I think one was there seemed to be more focus on gut health, which is great. Lots of probiotics, of course. But then also, on the food side, fermented foods, sauerkraut, kimchi. There was quite a lot of those companies out there that seemed like they had just gotten off the ground and were doing pretty well.

Ryan: That was really cool. When I travel I’m always worried about being able to get enough vegetables and to keep that, you know, the routine that I have at home in place or as close to in place as possible. So, I’ll just – you know this ’cause you were there but for everybody listening I just walked up and down the aisles all day both days we were there and ate as much kimchi and sauerkraut as I could so I could stay on track. But it was – it is really cool to see that. So, all of our favorite sauerkraut and kimchi brands were there and they were unveiling new flavors. I think it’s – is it mothers in the raw or one of those brands had a flavor that I’ve never tried. It was a white kimchi. I’m not a fan of the spice in kimchi, so this one was without the red pepper. It’s basically kimchi without the spice. So that was really good. Farmhouse Culture was another good one. I think we got Ben hooked on that.

Roy: Yes, we did. Yeah.

Ryan: So –

Roy: It was great to see.

Ryan: While we’re on that topic, can you elaborate? I think there’s a little confusion for some people between the difference of prebiotics and probiotics.

Roy: Sure, so – so to make it really simple, prebiotics are food for probiotics. And if you’re ingesting the right prebiotics, which are resistant starch, certain starchy tubers and things like that, they act as food for your probiotics. And if you’re ingesting these prebiotics on a regular basis you’re gonna build this culture of good bacteria in your gut that are feeding off those prebiotics. So, you’re basically super-charging your probiotics. And it helps get rid of the bad probiotics and also increase the number of good probiotics in your system such as bifidobacterium and – what is the other one? Lactobacteria.

Ryan: Yeah, that’s how most sauerkraut’s made, through that lacto-fermentation, right?

Roy: Yeah. So, it’s a super simple breakdown. But you need both. And – and probiotics them self are really delicate and really the best way to get them in your system is through fermented foods. In a supplemental form it’s really tricky. Heat, processing of any kind can damage and kill a lot of those active, live probiotics. So, it’s best to have some fermented food or things like that and then supplement that with prebiotics.

Ryan: Yeah. I think that’s a really good point about the delicacy of probiotics and I think a lot of people think: hey, even if I’m getting it out of the refrigerator at the vitamin store then, you know, I’m safe. But what we don’t know, what we can’t control is the process from manufacturer to that refrigeration unit in the store. So, how long was it in the warehouse? How long was it in the truck? What was the temperature? You know, if you’re transporting across the country in August, odds are by the time it reaches the refrigerator it’s not the product that you think you’re getting.

Roy: Exactly. Constantly heated and then cold and then heat and cold again. And those are active live bacteria in there that are very delicate. That’s why, with things like kimchi and sauerkraut, that’s continuing to ferment and continuing to build those bacteria even when it’s sitting in your fridge. So – so that’s really the best place to get that.

Ryan: Yeah. And I think both of us follow that protocol, eating fermented vegetables daily, taking prebiotic, the resistant starch complex at night for optimal gut health.

Roy: Yeah. I’ve been doing that for maybe 6 or 9 months now. And I’ve been eating kimchi every day for lunch and then also sometimes at dinner. And resistant starch in the afternoon and the evening. And – and really I do feel better. I’m more regular and – and I feel like I – my body composition is more on this, kind of, even keel.

Ryan: Yeah, I would have to say I’ve noticed the same thing. And you just mentioned bacteria. So, I’ve gotta jump to another booth and some people that we found very interesting is the Mother Dirt folks.

Roy: Yeah, totally interesting concept. Totally interesting concept. So these guys are spraying live bacteria onto your skin as a form of soap. So, it’s – it’s kind of the anti-soap soap. Spraying dirt on yourself and – but it’s – you start talking with this lady and there’s an amazing amount of research behind this thing. It’s been in RND for 10 years. Heavily funded. And – and I think they’re on the verge of something really cool here.

Ryan: Yeah, we actually – if you guys listening go back to, I believe it was podcast 18 we had Paul Jaminet on who wrote ‘The Perfect Health Diet’. He is affiliated somehow with these guys and he actually was the first to tell us about it. And the spray, the bacteria spray is AOB is ammonia oxidizing bacteria and it helps convert the bacteria or the sweat into nitric oxide. So, it was really interesting to hear him talk about it. But, like you said Roy, we got to run in – we got the rundown from Robin at the conference and we learned something interesting about the company’s founder. He hasn’t showered in 18 – or 13 years?

Roy: 13 years, I think it was. Yeah. Just been spraying bacteria on himself. And apparently, he’s still alive and well.

Ryan: Right. So – and he and the chief scientist are Harvard, MIT people. I mean, they’re really, really intelligent people. And, you know, I guess drop a hint for you guys listening. We actually are talking with them next week to line up a podcast with them so we’ll have them on, we’ll be able to dive a little bit deeper into that and bring you all of the information there on bathing, showering and covering yourself in bacteria.

Roy: Yeah, I’m interested in a little bit more about that science as well. You know, I know it’s supposed to be killing the ammonia so that you don’t get the smell. Um, but, you know, what else is it doing? How does it really keep your skin clean? And I think they have a shampoo, too, right?

Ryan: They have a shampoo and a cleanser. I think your description was perfect, it’s the anti-soap soap.

Roy: Right. Well that’s – yeah, it’s super cool. And it’s good to see things like that come up because rather than just a standard cold-brew coffee or beef jerky or nut butter, there was all kinds of nut butters there. It’s like wow, these guys are doing something super innovative and they’re getting some press and traction and this is what’s cool to see at events like this.

Ryan: Yeah, you’re right. Those – the booths that were different, that were doing things that nobody else was doing, those were really cool. There’s another one along that line, FATCO, formally FATFACE, they’ve just recently changed their name. But that’s another nose to tail use of the animal where they’re taking the tallow, creating skin care, beauty or hygiene products that are chemical free, made from animals. You know, nobody else there was doing that.

Roy: Right. Simple product and it works, right? You’ve been using that.

Ryan: Yeah. That’s what I use for deodorant. It’s called Stank Stop. [laughs] It’s awesome! And they’ve got a whole line. They’ve got lip balms and, you know, face moisturizers. That’s another podcast that we may actually try to set up and bring people because we talked about that with Andy on our podcast. Where – if our listeners go – if you just go into your bathroom and you look at the ingredients on the products that you put on your skin every single day. I mean, your skin’s your largest organ and you’re smearing chemicals onto it that are getting absorbed into your body every single day. So, I think in the world of biohacking, most areas are kind of exhausted or covered. And I think skin care and products like that is an area that is overlooked by a lot of people.

Roy: I think you’re right. I think there’s a lot of room for our industry to grow there. And I like Andy Hnilo’s concept is he wouldn’t put it on his skin if he wouldn’t eat it, right?

Ryan: Right.

Roy: And that’s a cool way to think about it. And I think we’ll see more products coming in that direction. And from a dietary supplement company like us, it’s interesting that minerals in particular are best absorbed transdermally. That’s why float tanks are so effective with the epsom salt. And so, I’ve been experimenting a little bit with magnesium oil and creams and seeing if we could fit them into the product line. And some interesting things we could do there. So, that’s – it’s an area of research that I wanna keep looking into.

Ryan: Yeah, especially with the magtein that’s in our MagTech is as bio-available as it is, as powerful as it is. I mean, that’s one that if we can increase the absorption you can – you’d see even more benefit.

Roy: Right, right. So, we’re gonna keep looking into that.

Ryan: Alright. What other ideas spark you or did you come away with saying: ‘Hey, we should look into this, we should do this’?

Roy: Well, I was talking to a lot of suppliers. You know, we have great suppliers in place for, for example, our krill oil and a lot of our minerals and some of our herbs. But always talking to new suppliers and kind of getting their angle and why they think their product is different or unique. And a lot of times, you know, we don’t learn anything new but it’s – it’s just good to get that perspective and it’s – it’s interesting um, how some manufacturers will position their product different than another manufacturer but it’s actually a very similar thing. Or there’s this whole debate, and particularly with medicinal mushrooms, functional mushrooms, which I’ve been doing some research into recently: chaga and reishi, lion’s mane, cordyceps. There’s this debate going on between the extracts and the whole concentrate supplements. So, you have this supplement that’s made from the entire mushroom that’s milled down into a dietary supplement. It’s kind of a whole spectrum complete supplement. And then on the other side they have these supplements that are very exact extracts that are going after a certain active component in that mushroom. And those folks are saying, you know, that’s how you get a really – a lot of effect out of this product. Whereas the other folks are saying it’s not a full-spectrum, mushrooms have all these synergistic ingredients and you need all of them working in conjunction and you’re gonna have more of a full body effect. So, it’s interesting to look at the research, which there really isn’t that much research in the mushroom world, and then trying to make those thoughts for yourself. Okay, which one is more effective? Or perhaps it needs to be a mix of both to really get what you’re really going after.

Ryan: Yeah. So, for you guys listening, if you’re not aware of how Natural Stacks operates, Abelard is a product creator and so is Roy. And you’re kind of hearing Roy’s thought process of how our products are created and you see the thought and the research that goes into them. And I think that’s one of the reasons that we’re able to bring to market products that we’re so proud of. You know, so Roy, I know that weighing that mushroom decision was a big part of your weekend. And I mean, it just – it almost sounds like there’s a civil war in the mushroom world, you know. You’ve got these 2 sides and both are adamant about, you know, their stance being the correct one. I mean, how do you – how do you decide this one’s right and, you know, this is, you know, if we wanted to make a mushroom product this is the side that we would choose?

Roy: Sure, and I haven’t decided yet. And I – we are looking into creating some mushroom products.  And – and it’s something that I’ll be looking at really closely. I think – I think the most important thing that was a takeaway is that we want an organic product, especially for mushrooms. A lot of the stuff coming from China has shown high levels of metal toxicity and absolutely that’s something that we don’t even wanna question. We want to make sure this stuff is from the source and from the get-go, you know, it’s a fungus so it has to be grown in a very controlled setting to get exactly the properties of that particular fungus without any interference. So, that was the biggest takeaway is that we’re looking for a U.S.A grown, organic product. And then, in terms of the extract versus the whole spectrum supplement, that’s something that I’m still looking at and it might differ between product. ‘Cause they’re extracting down to a certain active component and perhaps, in certain products, if we’re going for a certain effect we may want more of that whereas in another product, if it’s like an immunity product, it might be more important to have the full spectrum. Or in certain cases, maybe a combination of both. So that’s something that we’re playing with.

Ryan: Alright, right. It’s exciting. I know I can’t wait. I’m sure our listeners are looking forward to it. We’ve already had quite a few comments, people are anxiously awaiting. So, –

Roy: Yeah, there’s some interesting – interesting things in the mushroom world that aren’t available with typical herbs, vitamins or minerals.

Ryan: Yeah.

Roy: And – and it’s gonna be fun to explore in that space, for sure.

Ryan: Definitely. Now, you mentioned cold-brew earlier. There was a lot of coffee at the expo. We got to try a couple of new ones and a couple of old favorites. I was really pumped that we got to run into Caveman Coffee crew. I’ve had some interaction with them before but we’ve never met in person. That was cool. Those guys are amazing, they’re awesome. We had a blast hanging out with them.

Roy: Yeah, definitely very authentic guys. And they’re very passionate about their coffee. And their coffee tastes great. But what was – what was cool to me was their yerba matte. They’re coming out with this new yerba matte and they had it on a tap and I think they’re putting it into cans. But, completely pure product, no sugar or any additives or anything like that. Just – but the taste they’re able to get out of that was – was outstanding.

Ryan: Yeah, and I think we may be able to get them on the show at a future time as well to have them talk about it when it launches. But I believe that it was a nitro, their nitro coffee has been a big hit and the nitro that they add in the tap gives the coffee and now the tea just a thicker mouth feel without having to add anything else. They had a hibiscus tea that was awesome as well.

Roy: Yeah, exactly. It was almost foamy and it seemed a little thicker than just normal tea. And it – but yeah, it tastes great. And I think Keith was saying that he got the main idea from Tim Ferriss who we know is very adamant about yerba matte being his favorite drink and favorite cognitive booster. And it’s, you know, it is a very defined effect, completely different from coffee or green tea, even. And that’s something that I want to start experimenting more with.

Ryan: Yeah, he actually – he had me inspired to do the same. I’m drinking coffee today but I – Keith is – he said that he’s been drinking yerba matte in the mornings instead of coffee. And he said for about a week it was kind of a cumulative effect through that first week. And, you know, after that he said: ‘Man, this is it. This is what I want to do.’ So, it –

Roy: Yeah, it’s interesting.

Ryan: Yeah, it’s just really cool to hear different people’s different morning routines and what works and, you know, how they kinda get into the zone. Before we get off of the coffee topic, we made a stop to the Bulletproof cafe.

Roy: We did, yes.

Ryan: So Bulletproof is a brand that has always been, you know, good to us, we’ve been good to them and really enjoy their coffee as well so we had to see the mecca, see the shop. It was really cool to see what Dave has been able to create there. Tons of, you know, like-minded people hanging out. And I know I can say that if I lived close to one I’d be there every day.

Roy: Yeah, it was really cool to see. And you’re right, it was busy and you could tell it was very healthy people there. But the space he created is very nice. And I think the process of ordering, it’s all very comfortable. They bring the food out to you, you know, it’s not – there’s not much clutter going on. And – and the way that – you can tell there’s a lot of focus on the food and how they cook it and where it’s sourced. And the menu isn’t very complicated, there’s maybe 10 things on there but, yeah. You and I tried as many as we could. I think we ordered 7 or 8 things to try it all out and it was all great.

Ryan: It was. The food was excellent.

Roy: In particular the ice cream, the Get Some Ice Cream that they’ve put together was quite a bit better than I had expected, actually.

Ryan: Yeah, it was – it was really cool. I guess I was shocked to see it in – it was almost like when you walk into a 7-11 and the Slurpee machine is spinning around. Instead of being horizontal, theirs was vertical. But that ice cream was just churning the whole time and it was, you know, smooth, creamy. I mean, it tasted like real ice cream. I never would have known that it was, like, a healthy recipe.

Roy: Yeah, it was hard not to order, I think it was only 11am when we were there but we got to start off with a little ice cream.

Ryan: Yeah we had to. And, let’s see what – they had all kinds of breakfasts and protein bowls, you know, it was –

Roy: Steak, salmon.

Ryan: Yeah, it was almost like if you’ve read the Bulletproof Diet book or the Bulletproof recipe book, it was just, you know, imagine being able to order anything out of there and have it prepared and handed to you.

Roy: Right. And – and even just a cup of bone broth, you know, you can order that.

Ryan: Yeah.

Roy: Yeah, very cool to see. And I think he’s working on opening a couple other stores which should be great. It’s impressive what he’s done with this brand and it’s something that we look up to.

Ryan: For sure. Another guy that we got to run into again who has done a lot with his brand in the Paleo world is Mark Sisson.

Roy: Right. Great guy. I love Mark. He’s very authentic and he’ll shoot it to you straight. Certain products or other products that he does or does not like. And he’s been doing really well with his – his mayo, his avocado oil based mayo product. And now he has 3 or 4 different flavors. And that’s a cool product. I have some in my fridge that I use with artichokes. And it really tastes just like mayo, or if not better. And I know he’s doing really well off that. And I saw that he’s expanding into some new products, just released a protein bar base with collagen. And what I thought was interesting that rather than just using, like, cashews or almonds like other companies he added, actually, peanuts or pumpkin seeds. Which was cool. And it actually tastes pretty good.

Ryan: Yeah, that was a good bar. And, you know, my hope for that is that it can do for the bar world what his mayo did, you know, in that kind of, market.

Roy: It’s a tougher world, you know, there’s a lot of bars out there.

Ryan: It’s definitely more saturated than the healthy mayo.

Roy: Yeah. But – but like we said, you know, hopefully these trends continue and that those things get out there more.

Ryan: Yeah, I will second that. So, let’s –

Roy: And then the tiger nuts, too.

Ryan: Yeah!

Roy: We saw the tiger nuts were there.

Ryan: Yeah.

Roy: Which were super cool. And if you guys aren’t familiar, it’s those – it’s a weed plant that’s grown in Africa and the Middle East. And it’s a tuber so it’s grown underneath the ground and there’s these tiny little – I wouldn’t call it a nut.

Ryan: They look like nuts but they’re actually tubers. They’re shriveled, like a dried raisin but hard. They have that shriveled raisin look but they’re hard.

Roy: They don’t look very attractive but they actually taste pretty good, I’d say. I wouldn’t say great. And they now have a new version that has a lot of the peel taken off which is a little bit less chewy and more approachable, I’d say.

Ryan: The –

Roy: But that’s a cool product and very high in resistant starch.

Ryan: Yeah. It’s a – it’s about 50% resistant starch.

Roy: Yeah, that’s super high. I think even um, you know, our banana flour we use is about 30-40% max. So to have something that potent in a resistant starch in a small little punch like that is awesome.

Ryan: I’ve been taking those, they’re very portable and I’ve actually been taking them, like, the weather’s starting to break and we’ve been hiking a lot lately. So I just throw those into a Ziploc bag and put it in my pocket and I just eat those and some nuts while I’m hiking.

Roy: Yeah, good source of energy, too, fat and some sugars in there.

Ryan: Yeah.

Roy: I – I’ve kind of always dreamt of putting together an ultimate trail mix. And I’d like to put a few tiger nuts in there.

Ryan: What other ingredients would go in Roy’s Ultimate Trail Mix?

Roy: I’m still working on it daily, basically. But I like macadamias.

Ryan: Yeah.

Roy: And I’d probably throw a couple of Bulletproof’s truffle espresso beans in there.

Ryan: Yes, those are amazing.

Roy: Those are great. And, I think, 3 or 4, maybe 5 just high-quality ingredients like that. But a mix, right, so you have this resistant starch content, you have this great fat from macadamias and some chocolate and things like that. Maybe someday.

Ryan: Could be Natural Snacks.

Roy: Natural Snacks, coming up next. [laughs]

Ryan: So, before we shift gears into Q&A, I wanna just pause, kinda do a public service announcement, tell you guys listening. Make sure you head over to to see the video version of this, get the show notes. We’ll have links to all of the brands that we’re talking about, any of the studies or anything else that we mention going forward in the Q&A. That’s a great place to drop your questions if you wanna get your question answered by me on a show or by Roy and I on a future Q&A if that’s the way we decide to go forward with this. And if you haven’t already done so, please go to iTunes, leave us a 5* review, let us know how much you like the show. We’ve got a couple of new ones that we wanna read. Um, so here’s one from [unclear 00:31:29]: ‘Yep, hands down best podcast out there. Super easy to follow, soothing in the ears. Everything is broken down so you can understand. The topics are freakin’ awesome, keep up the good work.’ He says: ‘Yep, subscribe, it’s that good. Great podcast, very informative. The guests are awesome. Here’s another one from cousin [unclear 00:31:48], that’s a cool name: ‘Love the diversity of guests. Information you can use and the latest in biohacking and nootropics. Love Natural Stacks and love this podcast.’ So thank you guys. Make sure you head over and let us know, leave us a review. That’s how we know what you like, what to do more of. And we can make this, you know, the podcast that is your go-to resource.

Roy: That’s the goal. And recently we’ve seen a lot of questions come in so I wanted to get with Ryan on the podcast and help answer some of those and hopefully if that’s a format you guys like we’ll continue that.

Ryan: So, for you guys listening, in our small, tight-knit team we know Roy is an incredible cook and this is a perfect question for Roy to answer. So, we’ve been asked about cooking methods, reducing carcinogens and advanced glycation end products that can occur with overcooking meat or cooking at high temperatures. So, we’re gonna let chef, master chef Roy take that one and give us some advice.

Roy: Yeah, you’re not so bad a chef yourself. Some broiling techniques and everything else I saw last weekend. Um, well I love to barbecue and I like just being outside and getting some of that smell, some of the smoke. But as you know that the high heat, when you’re putting that meat on the grill, can cause some carcinogens. And it’s something that – that we’re conscious of and always trying to reduce that in any way we can. So, the first thing is just not to overcook the meat and, you know, you get a little bit of that barbecue char but not too much. And try to, you know, keep the meat as intact as possible without flaming it. But there are some interesting things you can do and seasonings and spices you can use to really mitigate the negative effects of a high heat cooking like barbecuing and my favorite is rosemary. And if you – if you look around and do the research there’s actually some very substantial research showing that rosemary, which contains rosmarinic acid, can greatly reduce the amount of carcinogens created from cooking at a high temperature. And it’s been shown that the higher concentration of rosemary, the rosmarinic acid, the greater reduction of that. And in some cases, up to 90%. So, almost completely eliminates the harm of cooking at a high heat if you’re using a lot of rosemary or getting a lot of that rosmarinic acid in there. And there’s also been some marinades combining garlic and onion. That’s been shown to be a similar effect, I don’t think quite as strong as rosemary. But some things that I like to do, personally, is either make a marinade and use a lot of rosemary and garlic and onions and turmeric, which is – other antioxidants help as well. And let it marinade for a long time. Or, the other way I like to do it is to make a dry rub with Himalayan salt and what I’ll do is I’ll take the rosemary leaves off the sprig and dice it up super fine and mix it in with some salt and some other spices. I like to use a little cayenne and really rub [unclear 00:35:19] – deep into the meat. And you almost get this layer of, you know, rosemary and salt on the outside that protects it even further and creates a great little crust and flavor for the meat, obviously.

Ryan: Alright, you guys listening have no idea what kind of secret you just heard. Because we’ve been bugging Roy for 2 years to explain to us his secret dry rub. And I’m not sure that was 100% of the ingredients but –

Roy: That was like 80%. I don’t –

Ryan: You guys got more than anybody has ever heard!

Roy: Yeah, no it’s – it’s great and I highly recommend it. And even if you’re doing something delicate, like a filet mignon, a small little fillet of steak, you can just put the whole rosemary sprig on the bottom underneath the steak where it would be on the grill and it helps infuse that rosemary into the steak and it also helps with the lower – significantly lowers the carcinogens that we’ve been talking about. Something else interesting about rosemary is – is that rosmarinic acid helps slow the breakdown of GABA. So, it keeps a higher, elevated amount of GABA in your brain which has calming properties and maybe that’s why it just naturally smells so good. And it just seems like a great nutrient to use and to – to use especially in something like this when you’re helping reduce some damage.

Ryan: Alright, you said the magic word: GABA. So, on behalf of all of the questions that have been sent in, do we have an ETA for GABA Brain Food?

Roy: Yeah, I looked through the questions. I think that was half of the questions. When’s GABA coming out? GABA Brain Food will be out really soon. I’ll say about 6 [unclear 00:37:12], if not less. So, it’s – it’s in the works, it’s already in production. We already have the final formula. We won’t share all of that yet. But it’s – it’s coming out soon and we’re really excited about it. People that have been playing with the other brain food products, dopamine and serotonin are anxious to get their hands on this one and really get a more full spectrum on what they can do with tinkering with their neurotransmitters.

Ryan: So you just – you already mentioned one of the ingredients, the rosmarinic acid.

Roy: Okay, well there you go. That is one of the ingredients, yes.

Ryan: And that helps GABA stay in our system longer, right?

Roy: Right, it’s – it slows the breakdown of GABA. So this formula, which is simple yet also very all-inclusive, has ingredients to promote the production of GABA, to slow the breakdown of GABA and then also help the absorption of GABA to get into the blood-brain barrier. Which, in general, if you look into our whole line of dietary supplements, we’re always looking at what’s out there and what are the most effective nutrients and what are the effects that we’re trying to get? But then how do we make this product better? And how do we improve upon what’s already on the market? Because there are products out there but – but we’re always looking to make something more effective. How do you make it better? And normally the one thing that is the problem with anything out there already is absorption. So, that’s really a focus of ours is how do make this nutrient better absorbed? How do you get it into your system, into your brain more effectively so that you can experience the full benefits of a product? So, you know, our magnesium – we’re using magnesium threonate which has been shown to get to the brain in other highly bio-available types of magnesium. For our creatine we’re using nutrients to help get the creatine into the system. With our E3 we add coconut oil because that’s synergistic and it’s fat-soluble to help get it into your system. Really all of our products are built that way.

Ryan: Yeah. And speaking of products that are on the market that may be able to be improved upon, here’s another question from somebody looking – they took the Braverman test and found that they were deficient in serotonin and GABA. They’re using our Serotonin Brain Food and because our GABA’s not out they’re using phenibut right now. So, they wanted to get our thoughts on phenibut and I know that you can speak clearly and well on that.

Roy: Yeah, well phenibut – it’s very powerful. It’s a chemical form of GABA that’s been modified to allow it to cross the blood-brain barrier. So it’s very effective and it’s very powerful. And it works, definitely. But because it’s – it’s almost forcing it into your blood-brain barrier into a non-natural – in a non-natural way, it does have some side effects. And it really shouldn’t be taken more than a couple times a week. There are some, kind of, horror stories out there. If people take it really frequently they have withdrawal symptoms and, you know, can’t sleep and can’t focus and they just need this thing. And it’s – it’s really – it’s almost addictive. You know, alcohol increases GABA and phenibut, I’d say, is – is almost like having 4 drinks [laughs]. And it’s not something to be played with. And it’s not something that you should be taking every day. You know, it’s designed to get across the blood-brain barrier, which is something we talked about, but there are other interesting ways to help GABA get across the blood-brain barrier. One of those ways is by increasing nitric oxide and there are several studies to support this. So, there are natural nutrients out there that can help increase nitric o- could help the absorption of the GABA. That’s something that you’ll see in our stack as well.

Ryan: Yeah, and we’ll probably have Abelard on the show in a couple of weeks when GABA is released to talk all about that metabolic pathway for GABA as well as the formula and all the ingredients.

Roy: Exactly. And all of our brain food products and all of our products in general are designed to be able to take every day. So, we’re sticking with the natural vitamin and mineral precursors, backing that up with functional herbs that can promote the natural production of GABA or slow the breakdown of GABA or whatever the thing is that we’re trying to increase. So, these are the natural building blocks. We’re not skipping any metabolic steps. We’re not forcing your brain into a state. We’re providing all the nutrients it needs to naturally get there. So, it’s – it’s not gonna be as powerful or as potent as phenibut but it definitely has a defined effect which you can feel and you can take it every day safely.

Ryan: That was gonna be – that is one of our next questions is, you know, can we take the brain foods every day? Are they designed to be taken every day?

Roy: Yes, exactly.

Ryan: Perfect. So, when GABA does come out, how would it fit in with the rest of the brain food line? When would we use it?

Roy: Well, each product is, kind of, a tool on the tool belt. And – that you can use in a different situation. So, GABA itself is an inhibitory neurotransmitter. So, it actually reduces the amount of stimulation that a neurotransmitter can be. It reduces the excitement and it slows the transmission between the neurotransmitters so it’s relaxing. It has a very calming effect. And, for me, I would take it in the afternoon or evening when I’m trying to unwind. Reduce anxiety, so you can kind of have more clear thoughts. And for me it almost makes you more empathetic and able to focus on some deeper thoughts rather than some more, I’d say, top-level, you know, everyday things. It allows you to kind of get deeper and focus more on your feelings. It sounds a little ‘woo-woo’ but it’s true. And it also helps with, like, awkward social situations. It kind of –

Ryan: Like 4 drinks of alcohol [laughs].

Roy: Exactly! Exactly. And if you’re going to meet someone for the first time or in a situation at work, maybe when you’re having a meeting with a bunch of colleagues that may not be your best friends, taking some GABA can really help ease that situation and help you act more naturally and almost ease the communication between people because you’re in this calm, relaxed state. So, those are the situations I would take it is if you’re doing some public speaking or going to an awkward situation or trying to just, in general, reduce some anxiety at work. Or at the same time if you’re just trying to unwind it can really help. Later in the evening, too, with sleep. I’ve been experimenting a bit with that, taking it later in the night to really get some deeper – fall asleep faster and then be able to stay asleep in a deep state.

Ryan: GABA has always helped me pass out and sleep like a baby.

Roy: Yeah. Yeah, I think –

Ryan: And that’s – that’s with a formula that doesn’t cross the blood-brain barrier. I mean, that was just, you know, GABA from the vitamin store off the shelf years ago.

Roy: Right, no it really does help with sleep and getting asleep. But at the same time it doesn’t knock you out. You know, it’s not like taking a bunch of melatonin or something. You can take it during the day just fine and you’re not gonna all of the sudden feel like you’re gonna wanna take a nap. But, again, it relaxes you into that state where you can easily fall asleep if you wanted to.

Ryan: Alright. So, I know I’m excited, I know a lot of people are excited to see this one come out. So, we already talked a little bit about some mushrooms. I’ve got 2 questions left here at the end. Do you see anything – any other questions that we haven’t covered?

Roy: Um, no. Go for it! Shoot!

Ryan: Alright. Well, people wanna know your daily routine. Your stacks, your regimen, what you do and why. So from the time you wake up to the time you go to bed. Take us through the –

Roy: A long time.

Ryan: Take us through a day in Roy’s life.

Roy: There’s a lot of stuff going on, man. I don’t know if we have time. Recently I’ve been mixing it up a bit and trying to – trying to get away from the same consistency every day. So, I used to first thing hang upside-down every day. And now I’m kind of switching that up. Sometimes I’ll do that in the afternoon or sometimes in the morning I’ll try to get more outside time. And, I think just keeping it random, keeping it fresh is good for idea flow and – and just being more in the present. So, I think with any routine it’s great to re-evaluate every couple months and maybe mix it up but always – you always know you can do that and go back to this state where you know this creates an optimal situation for you. But then keep pushing, keep experimenting and, you know, seeing if you can improve upon that. So that’s – that’s really important. I’ve also been – at the same time I’ve been kind of working on more structure. So I’ve been blocking out times in my calendar a week or 2 in advance and it will just be like a random time, like Wednesday afternoon is Roy’s study time. And I have several hours where it’s just okay, that’s my personal time. I’m not going to work during that time, I’m gonna read or I’m gonna learn something new or I’m gonna go on a walk. And then it’s almost – it forces yourself to do that, you know. I get so busy and caught up that – and you forget about taking some time back to really relax and maybe read or learn something new. But it’s on your calendar and you see it there. And maybe it won’t happen at that time because you are busy, but then you can push it to a later time or push it to the next day and it’s still on your calendar and you’re still going to get something done in that space. So, I’ve been playing with that, having more structure and planning things ahead a little bit. Another thing that I’ve been doing more recently, now that the weather’s turning a bit, is I’ve been doing really long walks in the woods. And I’m talking, like, 2 hours. So, just going with my wife or my dog or both or – or by myself. Usually early afternoon. So, after I’ve done a lot of the main work for the day. I got the day-to-day stuff taken care of. I’ll try to step back and go on a long walk. And I’ve found that I’m – by the time I get back I have all kinds of ideas that I’m ready to implement and it’s – it just feels great. So that’s something that I’ve really been enjoying recently. In the evening, to unwind, I’ve been playing with GABA, which has been great. But also raw honey. And shout-out to Seth Roberts whose no longer with us, one of the pinnacle biohackers out there, has done a lot of research with raw honey and I’ve been looking at his blog recently. What I’ve been doing is taking some goat yogurt and mixing in prebiotic, our product Prebiotic+. And the taste is great just right there. But then I’ll add a full tablespoon of raw honey to that and mix it up. And that’s – that’s been my recent night time cocktail. And it – it really puts me to sleep pretty well. So honey raises your blood glucose, your brain needs this glucose to function. Sleep is a very complex thing in your brain and if you don’t have enough glucose at night you can disrupt your sleep. And there’s a bunch of studies that prove this. And especially if you’re a pretty low-carb person in general and you’re not consuming many carbs during the day, if you get that little hit of carbs at night, especially in a natural form like raw honey, it really does activate this effect. Have you played around with that at all?

Ryan: Yeah, actually when Dave Asprey started talking about it a couple of years ago as his night time thing I played around with it. I’ve gotten away from it when I started doing the prebiotic. I have not mixed the 2 together, which would be an interesting experiment. I think the biggest anecdotal evidence I have with it is there was a diabetic patient who was a member of the gym and I was helping him pretty intensely with his nutrition and we actually – he was at the point where his doctor was about to put him on insulin injections. And I said, you know, look beg him for 3 months and we’ll turn this thing around. And we got him to the point where eventually he was, you know, no diabetes medication at all, blood sugar was, you know, always in the normal range, A1C was down, you know, in the sixes which was great. But in that transition period when he was experiencing lower blood sugar – lower blood sugar levels through the changes he was making um, the medicine was almost like, you know, a sledgehammer when you needed, you know, a tap. And he was bottoming out at night. He’d wake up in the middle of the night with his blood sugar in the forties. You know, I’m not in the position to say: ‘Hey stop taking your medicine.’ But, you know, look you need to talk to your doctor and tell him that this is what’s going on. But in that intermediate time, we had him take honey at night right before he went to bed. And he could sleep through the night without waking up. So, he’d wake up, you know, more rested and he never had those blood sugar crashes. So, you know, he wasn’t hooked up to any machines, we don’t have the science but we know that, you know, he didn’t crash, he didn’t, you know, have any adverse effects and it actually helped him kinda bridge that gap from, you know, really, really high blood sugar, really high levels of insulin medication, you know, to nothing and controlling diabetes on his own through diet and exercise.

Roy: That’s awesome.

Ryan: Yeah. So, honey at night’s a good thing.

Roy: Yeah! Try it out. Try it out.

Ryan: Yeah.

Roy: And a lot of people are, especially in our space where people are ketogenic and people are Paleo and really reducing carbs. Honey could be kind of a scary thing, you know. What, I’m just gonna consume all this sugar at night? Um, but it’s actually – it’s pretty powerful and it’s not like you’re just gonna start packing on pounds ’cause you have a little bit of honey at night.

Ryan: Yeah, I think that’s – that’s one of the things that has been an interesting lesson over the last couple of years. The more I’ve gotten into biohacking, the more my thoughts have shifted in the world of nutrition and fitness is that, you know, there was a time where, you know, when I was all about body-building or macros or – I would have had that same response: ‘Oh, you want me to eat a teaspoon of honey? Like, no way!’ And especially at night, right before I go to bed. But I think now I think we realize – and especially in this space we realize that real health and, you know, real fitness is, you know, you can have a little bit of honey and if it’s gonna help you sleep, we know the benefits of sleeping better. And if your body’s gonna go haywire from a teaspoon of honey, there’s probably a larger underlying problem with your metabolism.

Roy: Right, right. And I feel like we are kinda in this Renaissance era – era of health where there’s a lot more studies coming out and there’s a lot more people doing the research and – and expressing their research online and what they’ve found with that research. So, is it John Kief- ?

Ryan: Yeah, Kiefer.

Roy: Kiefer that has the carb backloading concept that he really has been talking about and there’s a lot of studies to back that up. It’s a really interesting time to try to cipher through all the research, really.

Ryan: Yeah.

Roy: And everyone’s kinda saying a slightly different thing and figuring out what’s best for you. It’s fun stuff.

Ryan: Yeah, I’m glad you mentioned Kiefer, he’s one of my favorites. And I think that the science that he presents in carb backloading is some of the most compelling and interesting science in how to structure your days and set up your, I guess, your nutrition plan and template. I think, personally, I follow a – if you lay that and Bulletproof diet as a Venn diagram kinda where they intersect is where I live.

Roy: Sure, sure. I feel like I kinda – I do that as well. And I maybe also throw in a little Tim Ferriss low-carb and a trifecta diagram there. ‘Cause I’ll eat some beans and legumes and some more slow carbohydrates. But again, in the evening where I’m using that carb backloading concept.

Ryan: Absolutely. So, before we let you go, Roy, you have to answer the question that all of our guests answer. Not that you’re a guest, but – and I know we said we wouldn’t do this as if I were interviewing you. But you’re here. We need your top 3 tips to live optimal.

Roy: I feel like I’ve already given 10! [laughs] I’d say number 1: get outside and go for a long walk. Really that’s been pretty amazing for me. And the – this body that we live in is designed to walk. And, you know, that’s why we’re on 2 legs and it just feels natural and – and I’ll go on a walk just in the neighborhood on the road and I get burned out pretty quick and, like, my knees will start to hurt or I’ll just – I’m ready to go home. But when I get on – into the woods, I can really go for much farther. I don’t really have any aches and pains. It’s just my mind is in a better state. But that’s something that just – even if you aren’t on a road go ahead and walk for a while, for an hour, you know, and see how you feel afterwards. It’s pretty cool. I think a lot of people have done that, but – nothing ground-breaking there. But go out for a walk.

Ryan: I like it, I like it. It’s simple but it’s profound. I’ve definitely been doing that a lot more and I will agree and second everything that you just said.

Roy: Do you have a time of day that you prefer to do that?

Ryan: I think it varies. I think what you said earlier about not being in a routine is a very big thing. I think – I know we’ve talked about your lifting and exercise protocol before. I know you lift less frequently than I do. If I’m going to lift, like on a day like today I will lift shortly after we record this but I probably won’t walk. I may walk later in the day for a shorter one. But on a day where I don’t lift I typically will work most of the day and I find that I start to go stir-crazy without that break to move. ‘Cause like you said, I mean, we’re designed to move. So, I would either set it up to where I – I get up and walk first thing that morning or very much like you said, you get up, bang out the stuff that needs immediate attention, kinda get through that first wave and then take a break, walk, recharge, clear your mind, let those new ideas come in and then you come in ready to implement for kinda that second phase. ‘Cause that’s another thing that I don’t think we’re – we’re not naturally designed, if you will, to work, you know, that 8-5.

Roy: Yeah.

Ryan: That’s not how our – our biology doesn’t suit or fit that. So, to kinda break that up and work in bursts you can be more productive and, you know, in a better mood when you are working.

Roy: And also, I’ve found that segmenting my work so – so in the morning and early afternoon I’ll focus on kind of the more day-to-day stuff, what needs to get done. What are my main goals for the day? And I’ll try to tackle those. And in the afternoon I tend to work on more long-term projects. So that’s writing or researching or – or bigger projects in general that require almost more of a creative brain. Almost more a relaxed state. You can’t really get there if you’re kinda worked up trying to get things done for the day.

Ryan: Yeah.

Roy: So that helps quite a bit, too, is – so you have these things you wanna do today but how can I structure them in your day to be the most effective at doing that?

Ryan: Yeah, that’s a good point about, like, the creative work and you have to have the clutter gone in order to make these – come up with new ideas and make connections or to do new stuff. So, whatever works for you as an individual, you need to find that process and be able to be clutter-free in your mind. And I’m sure you can vouch for, you know, those bursts of ideas or ‘a-ha’ moments. They come all the time and at random times and usually when you’re least expecting or wanting them to come through.

Roy: Yeah. Okay, so here’s my next tip is: I always have a yellow pad. Yellow pad here. Pretty old school. But I’ll write stuff down throughout the day. So, I’ll have my to-do list that – I don’t put a ordered to-do list first. So I can – able to use my day in a flexible manner, it’s not like I have to do this one first and this one second. Here’s things I wanna do and I do ’em when it feels right. But having this paper allows you just to off-load your ideas when they come quickly and easily. And then you can always refer back. And if you’re – if you don’t carry around a yellow pad like I do just use your phone. You know, drop it in the notes or whatever you use to take notes. But being able to quickly off-load the information allows you to get to the next step and focus on the bigger picture of things. So that’s really important.

Ryan: That’s funny. I use a yellow legal pad as well for my to-do list. It’s out of reach or I’d hold it up. And I do the note on my phone for more of, like, this thing just popped into my head I can usually voice speak it into the phone and then it syncs to my computer and, you know, I’ve got – I’ve got so many notes that, you know, and then when you’re ready to do that if it’s an e-mail or if it’s a blog or an article, whatever it is, it’s there. You can copy and paste it wherever you need it and just build out on that idea.

Roy: Yeah, I use that, too, my phone, when I don’t have my pad. And I prefer to write down things. I feel like I’m learning it again and I’m memorizing it. And also having a notebook by my bed because sometimes when I’m trying to relax I’ll all of the sudden have these ideas and I can’t relax until I get them out of my head and I’ve – okay, I’ll worry about that tomorrow but at least I don’t have to remember to worry about it tomorrow.

Ryan: Right, right. Absolutely.

Roy: So, that’s a good time to have a notepad.

Ryan: Yeah. Alright, so notes or notepad, walk outside. One more.

Roy: One more. Alright, you’re really pushing today. Um, one more. I’d say just try something new. Switch up your routine. And if that’s don’t drink coffee for a day or – or, you know, spend more time outside or try raw honey at night, whatever it is, a different workout routine, hanging upside down. Try doing some stretching. I think most people just don’t stretch. And for me it’s – it’s kind of something that I do every day to just loosen up my body and feel like I don’t have these blocks and energy spots where my knee’s tight and my back’s tight. And just being loose helps everything else. I don’t – is that a point?

Ryan: I like –

Roy: Try something new.

Ryan: Yeah, try something new. I like it, I like it. And you make a good point about being tight, you know. If we can’t move the way we’re designed to, you know, that’s kind of the foundation on which everything else is built, especially physical performance. You know, if you wanna run fast or jump high that’s the performance expression of, you know, those foundations and, you know, we can’t do that if we don’t have, you know, if you can’t do a body-weight spot you’re certainly not gonna squat 500 lbs., so –

Roy: Yeah. Well, it depends on how much you weigh, Ryan. [laughs]

Ryan: Well, that’s true. True. Alright, Roy, this has been great. We’re gonna let you go ’cause you probably have other things to do, our listeners have – you guys have certainly gotten a lot of information today. So, please, if you guys have thoughts or feedback on this format for the podcast let us know. Leave us a comment. However you consume the podcast, whether it’s iTunes, the blog, YouTube videos, whatever it is, let us know your thoughts and we will – like I said earlier – we’ll tailor this to make this a – the ultimate resource for you, to the best of our ability.